Monday, October 22, 2007

If London won't go to Crestwood…

…won't Crestwood come to London?

Not only has the village not increased its property tax in 39 years, it has cut the rate every year, to a current low of 38 cents per $1,000 of assessed valuation.
Crestwood, Illinois also rebates half or more of the property tax collected from residents, charges $1 for business licences and no impact fees to developers, and all the while provides police and services that include:
garbage removal, sidewalk replacement, street maintenance, water maintenance, sewer repairs, park maintenance and grass cutting, water meter reading and billing, ambulance service, engineering, bus service anywhere in the village for $1.10 a ride, a senior citizen center, youth services.
Crestwood's secrets? Nothing astonishing, as it happens… read the rest here.
Asked if other mayors might get some ideas by studying how Crestwood is run, Stranczek demurred. "I don't give advice to other mayors; they can swim on their own."


mariposa said...

I want to move, now!

Years ago when there was talk of a potential garbage strike here (or maybe we had a brief one - I can't remember now), a friend who had moved from London said, "Why don't they privatize garbage removal. That's what most other cities do."

Incredible, a mayor who believes in running his town like a business in order to be fiscally responsible! It shouldn't be incredible to me, but having lived in London for more than 25 years I've become accustomed to willy-nilly tax increases and outrageous spending.

Maybe someone should pass this article on to City Hall (for all the good it would do).

Anonymous said...

If you're interested in camparing apples with apples, it should be noted that Crestwood, Illinois, gets a direct share of the sales tax (unlike London) and that Crestwood has ended residential development (unlike London).

In London, residential development does not pay for itself due to all pro-development ying-yangs on city council who refuse to raise the development fees in order to give taxpayer's a break.

mariposa said...

So then in your opinion London shouldn't even try to save taxpayers' money - they should just keep spending foolishly as they have for years - ie. Stonehenge, fake trees, etc.

Privatizing services would save a lot of money - just like Crestwood has. Not just labour costs either - no unnecessary equipment sitting idle, having to be maintained just waiting for bad weather.

There's plenty of options for giving taxpayers a break, but this council couldn't care less about anything that doesn't involve spending more money that doesn't belong to them.

Elaine said...

London city council could never be described as efficient. They had five cents they would have to squander it on something foolish.

Too many people on the payroll, who do sweet fuck all. Made up jobs, and redundant, two human rights watchdogs, one for the girls, and one for the boys, who do what? No one seems to know down there, or do they care...and Gina frothing at the mouth to hire another useless tit who will go by the handle of Integrity commissioner.

Our city is doomed by the entitlement mindset of the do nothings, and be paid well for it.

eng said...

They should try zero based budgeting.

MapMaster said...

They should, but council tends to follow administration's lead on such dry matters as in-department budgeting, and one could see a lack of enthusiasm for the idea in those quarters. And at least one Controller, Gina Barber, has gone on the record as opposing zero-based budgeting.

As for the anonymous commenter, I don't see why you feel the need to make a comparison between London and Crestwood. There are obvious differences, of course, and no one is suggesting London could replicate Crestwood's successes, but the village demonstrates what can happen when elected officials are committed to "lean, efficient" government.

Anonymous said...

mariposa missed the jist of what I was saying altogether (what else is new?) and MapMaster asked why I've made the comparison between Crestwood and London -- when that was clearly the entire purpose of posting the story in the first place.

You people need to get out and stretch your legs a bit more. Get the oxygen back into the ol' noggins.

And instead of the non-stop whining and snivelling, get up off your fat crusty asses and either move to Crestwood, Illinois (where, no doubt, you'd find something else to bitch about) or get involved at city hall to convince the pro-development shit-heels to make development pay for growth. No more taxpayer subsidies for the urban sprawl-tree-cutting clowns that have been driving up our taxes to the tune of 30 per cent or so during the past seven years.

You know who these dorks are -- Development consultant Tom Gosnell, Spud Polhill, Big is Better Gord Hume, Realtor Cheryl Miller, Roger (Cement Head) Caranci, Paul Van Meathead, Bernie MacDonald, Steve (Which Way is Up?) Orser, Paul Hubert and Walter Lonc.

Instead you sit back, don't even vote and complain until you sound like a friggin' boring broken record. You're all spayed, neutered or emasculated. The men here are wussies and the women are shrivelled-up old crones.

Right now, no one's buying your baloney, so get out there and mobilize! At least give it the ol' college try!

Elaine said...

Barry, you are letting that ambASSordy thingmajig go to your little pointed head.

Are you trying to suggest this city council is responsible, fiscally or any other way?

London city council lack the vision, and common fucking sense to realize go after business that would bring real dollars into this town.

The socialist cabal are under the illusion that selling wormy organic apples at the downtown market, and letting some foreign artist spray paint a wall on some old dilapidated building downtown, is somehow making this city a vibrant and economic force in southwestern Ontario.

The stupid sons of bitches are even trying to let on that London is somehow going to gain from the auto manufacturing business that are being set up in every area except London. is comical, they are trying to let on they are somehow a part of it. London is not going to get a whiff off of Woodstock's or Cambridge's fart.

Anonymous said...

Elaine, re-read my post. Your response is so incredibly stupid I swear that you really do have shit for brains.

You think that I'm saying that the majority of our council is smart?

Elaine said...

Barry, you are trying to suggest the socialist cabal at city hall is all for economic growth.

Who the fuck do you think is sending out the message that London is not open for manufacturing jobs?

That would be your socialist cabal, whose only real jobs in life has been paying the gardener to prune back thier roses.

Anonymous said...

This is why the municipalities of Ontario were merged into mega-municipalities, and then put into a regulatory straitjacket by Queens Park w.r.t. property tax evaluations, water and sewer policy, etc., etc., etc. - to prevent any possibility of a Crestwood Incident, in which one municipality out-competes other municipalities on the basis of price and quality of services and thereby attracts more residents and businesses. Parasites do much better when the parasitic hosts are denied the ability to find a more hospitable environment. Until of course the hosts die off or give up and become parasites themselves, but hey - bankruptcy and harsh IMF-imposed austerity plans are at least 5, maybe 10 years away. It'll be a bloodsucker's ball until then.

MapMaster said...

London is at least 10 years, half a dozen provincial bailouts, and a catastrophic recession away from even remotely running itself like Crestwood. If you'd like to read a comparison into the post, that's all right, but it was intended as an example that things do not have to be as they are in London.

By the way, the London Fog has been on record numerous times for having development pay for itself, but it would be nice for the city to reciprocate in some form by lowering unnecessary external costs (i.e., taxes). And we've also long advocated replacing property taxes with a single municipally-priced sales tax.

The most recent anonymous commenter is exactly correct — the Ontario Municipal Act gives cities carte blanche to do almost anything they'd like except to restructure their finances and services to compete with other cities. There's no incentives for politicians to govern themselves and introduce efficiencies except if the incentive is a political one. As long as municipalities continue to fund advocates for the opposite, it will be an uphill battle to provide that political incentive… but new ventures for doing just that are on the horizon.

Anonymous said...

Elaine, you're too dense to participate in any rational debate. Stick to your basket weaving as prescribed by your mental health case worker.

You're caught up in meaningless labels and stereotyping -- the signpost of a lazy and diseased mind. People that can't or don't think, rely on labels for people. Like shopping for soup.

The auto manufacturing plants are going to the surrounding towns and cities because of much cheaper land acquisition costs and yes, lower taxes.

What's driving London's tax rates up are not $25,000 grants to arts and community groups but the never-ending mega-infrastructure costs of funding urban sprawl to unserviced areas -- roads, curbs, gutters, sidewalks, sewers, hydro, bridges, new schools and libraries.

For example, the Oxford Street West bridge over the Thames River was more than $23-million.

It's a never-ending cycle of ever-increased costs. More sprawl, more cars, more road widenings.

This new development is not adding revenue, it's draining London's coffers.

Only by reining-in helter-skelter growth will London be able to lower taxes or stabilize them.

But guess who wants London taxpayers to continue to subsidize the land development industry?

That's right. The Keep London Growing Coalition (a group co-organized by Gosnell and company), who want to build in every direction at the same time, into unserviced areas.

But when council debates raising development charges, all hell breaks loose from this same gang of phoney-baloney bandits.

Meanwhile back at the London Psychiatric Hospital, Elaine Shit-for-Brains (who nobody has ever taken seriously outside of the provincial nut-hut, aka looney bin) rails against the so-called "socialist cabal" trying to curtail urban sprawl -- "socialist cabal" is a term cooked up by development consultant Tom Gosnell who also fills in as our deputy mayor when he's not lobbying staff on behalf of his deep-pocket clients.

Ol' Elaine Shit-for-Brains, who hasn't ever had an original thought banging around in that empty skull of hers, has to ape our development consultant deputy mayor.


If all Canadians were as stupid as Elaine, you wouldn't even need weapons to take over this country. Just fill their empty heads with propaganda and cheesy bullshit and set them loose. They'd do all the dirty work for you.

mariposa said...

To anonymous:

1. I didn't miss your point at all. As Mapmaster said, Crestwood is simply one very good example of a competently run community. And as I said, there's no reason why London couldn't do better for taxpayers than what they are currently doing. Obviously you disagree with that statement. Instead you and the idiots at city hall seem to think a blank check for any pet project (PA centre) is a good idea.

2. I do vote - in all elections. Municipal, Provincial, Federal. Always have, always will.

3. I will continue to "bitch" about our city government as much as I want. I bitch directly to them as well for all the good it does. If you don't like the bitching here, then go over to alt-london where you'll find like-minded assholes.

4. And finally, you disagree with people here so you resort to the usual name-calling - You're all spayed, neutered or emasculated. The men here are wussies and the women are shrivelled-up old crones. Really intelligent mature debate there - and you have the nerve to tell others that they have shit for brains. Give me a break!

Anonymous said...

mariposa, Crestwood, Illinois collects a "sales tax."

London cannot collect a sales tax under the current Municipal Act.

Crestwood has capped residential development.

If London did that, all the right-wing, pro-development nutjobs in town would come crawling out of the woodwork and sewer pipes screaming bloody murder.

So the comparison is apples to oranges, not apples to apples.

As posted above, the single biggest drain on London's revenue is infrastructure costs, both capital and operating.

Uncontrolled residential growth is what's driving London's ongoing tax hikes, where development charges don't cover the full costs of development.

Elaine said...

hahahahaha, excellent post Mariposa.


I too vote, and I figure that gives me the right to bitch.

Even if I didn't vote, I still have the right to bitch because of the great gobs of taxes I pay.

Uncontrolled spending on stupid stuff is what is driving the tax hikes here in London.

London city council does not seem to have the brightness needed to attract well paying jobs to London. Anyone wanting to come in the socialist cabal set up every road block they can think of. "The trees! what about the trees!"

Barry, come on, you guys over on alt crying about some guy wanting to clear some trees for a golf course? Carrying on like it is going to be the end of the earth.

Give us a break, you are a part of the anti-business, anti-growth movement here in London

Elaine said...

....Barry you calling the men on this site wussies, while you and the limped-dicked males over on alt are holding a funeral for a fucking tree.

You men over on alt get anymore pussified, and we'll have to be carting you over to the health clinic for testosterone shots.

Anonymous said...

Elaine, I'll repeat myself because it's clear that you don't really read the posts of others.

You're too dense to particpate in any rational debate. You're like week-old dung on the ass of a horse.

Regarding bitching about government, of course that's normal. What is not normal is when that's all you ever do, which seems to be the case around here.

If you feel so strongly about your lousy lot in life and how government is screwing you, stand up and do something to actually change things. Contantly moaning about it doesn't quite cut it.

What do you call someone who takes it up the arse day in and day out and only complains about it? Does the word "bum-boy" ring a bell?

Alt-London posts a wide variety of stories -- from straight news to opinion -- something that seems to eludes your empty head.

Alt-London posted the Internal Memo about the tree-cutting permit application by Southside Construction -- actually breaking the story, another FACT that eludes your empty head.

Real men and women get results, enuchs and flakes like you only dream about results.

Elaine, your non-stop whining, snivelling and complaining is boring. Try something different for once in your life. Break out of your rut. Something, anything? Start your own website. Then you could stop being a parasite and Internet troll.

Tell us a story where you corrected an injustice or helped somebody out. That would be a start down the road towards your redemption.

Otherwise, when you arrive at the Pearly Gates, St. Peter's going to drop-kick you down below, with the words, "Be gone evil crone, you've another million years in Purgatory before you're ready to stand in the sunshine."

Regarding your disdain for trees, that is indicative of your overall contempt for life itself and your dry, desert-like mind.

Elaine said...

Well whoopdefuckingdo, alt london broke a story about a guy wanting to put in a golf course, on their property. Well not the socialist cabals property, but in their little commie minds, it is their land.

Whoooooooa hold me back, that big story has me on the end of my chair, holding my breathe waiting for the next saga of that breaking news.

Do you guys at alt have any idea how retarded you appear by trying to stop business, especially entertaining venues, sitting up shop in London?

Your alt breaking stories about trees, are pretty fucking boring to people who do not have orgasams over watching a bear taking a shit in the forest.

P.S: your not listening...I am doing lots and lots of things.

mariposa said...


As Mapmaster said Crestwood was used as an E-X-A-M-P-L-E. Do you understand the difference between an example and a comparison? The two were not presented side by side (like in a comparison).

And as I said, London can still do better regarding wasteful expenditures. Privatizing city services is achievable here and would be one way to save money. Other Canadian cities have done so.

Anonymous said...

I know you're busy elaine, much the same way that the inmates at an insane asylum are preoccupied.

Elaine's typical day:

6 AM: Roll out of fartsack and have dump.

6:15 AM: Stare out window dreaming up ways to kill trees and destroy life on the planet.

6:30 AM: Start computer and try to read Free Press, Alt-London and London Fog.

7:00 AM: Stare out window dreaming up ways to kill trees and destroy planet.

Repeat until 24 hours have been wasted. Repeat until death.

Mike said...

Butch and Elaine, STFU already.

Elaine said...

hahahahahahaha, ok

Barry just go back over to your site and mourn for dead trees. I know it is pretty dead and boring over there, but I am worried about you blowing a kanooter value, and passing away.

Who would protect all the weeds and bramble on other people's property if you were to kick the can?

Anonymous said...

mariposa, an example or a comparison? Whatever.

If you're going to hold out a municipality as a paragon of how to keep taxes low, it's also relevant to point out some of the specific details such as one juridiction's ability to collect sales tax as well as property taxes amd one municipality's unusual choice to cap residential development.

Regarding London or any municipality for that matter, endeavouring to trim excess spending, who could disagree with that. That's obvious.

It's one of the reasons Alt-London made a big deal about the fact that the president of CUPE Local 107 (London's outside workers) had cut a secret sweetheart deal with the City of LOndon whereby he collected many thousands of dollars annually (and still is as far as I know) in pay over and above the duly negotiated collective agreement between the City and CUPE Local 107.

Such a practice flies in the face of the collective bargaining process and is unlawful.

So accusing me or Alt-London of favouring pissing away City tax dollars is bogus as are the ongoing harebrained ramblings of your most prolific poster on this site, elaine Shit-for-Brains.

And by the way, you won't find any story on Alt-London in favour of a Performing Arts Centre, notwithstanding your previous poorly researched remark about this subject.

Elaine said...

....and you won't see any story against a Performing Art's center either on alt.

Members of council want to waste millions of dollars on a performing art's center in London, and alt doesn't consider that newsworthy...not a mention.

Sometimes the no news speaks volumes.

Anonymous said...

As usual, elaine you're wrong again.

There's been several articles on Alt-London opposing a Performing Arts Centre over the years -- the most recent was written by News Hound about two to three weeks ago.

This is what I mean, folks, about elaine. Her lips start flapping like a crazy mongoose before she has a clue what she's writing about.

She makes more wrong assumptions than a dead skunk steamrolled by a transport truck.

She's a total nutjob with zero credibility. Her batting average for getting anything right is minus 300. Way below the Mendosa Line. Down into the hillbilly-retard zone.

Elaine said...

Newshound was complainning as to the partnership with UWO and the location, not the performing art's center per se.

Go and get the links, and if I am right, you can suck Cartman's balls

Mike said...

If you boomers cost us our 2007 CODNA with this thread, I am so going to complain about it.

Anonymous said...

elaine, you stated there were no articles on Alt-London against a PAC. There's been plenty over the years, including the latest by News Hound posted on October 4, 2007.

Now you're trying to qualify News Hound's criticism, telling me to kiss some jerk's balls if I'm wrong?

elaine Honey Pot Sugar Scoop, you're wrong about everything.

Don't you think that it's time to fess up, admit you're a certified idiot and call it a day?

Elaine said...

....the article by newshound, was not against the PAC, it was against Gosnell wanting to build it out in the woods by UWO.

...get your chap stick on Barry, Cartman is waiting.

Anonymous said...

Oh, I get it elaine, now you purport to speak on News Hound's behalf.

You say he really supports a PAC, but doesn't want it built at UWO, eh?

Total bullshit, as usual.

If you ever got one single thing right, I think I'd drop dead in shock.

But you enjoy being a total screwball, don't you? A bit of a freak of nature. But then Internet trolls are always nuts.

Elaine said...

Cartman is waiting,start licking your chops Barry.

Where is the article Barry? all the articles on alt that state that PAC is a great big waste of taxpayer money? There are none on alt.

You guys got to kiss Gordo's ass because someone is going after a creative cities grant.

blowing and sucking at the same time seems to be an art with alt.

I see by your latest article you are content to have London turn into a retirement town. No doubt you and the socialist cabal on council would like to see that happen. You got what? 20, maybe 25 years left to live? A retirement town would be good for you, and the socialist cabal, but it is not that appealing to young working families.

Elaine said...

...and, Barry, if you glowtards don't understand if you don't work towards building a strong economy, those youngin's aren't going to be giving a second thought to pulling the plug on your ventilators.

Anonymous said...

More lunacy from the Village Idiot on London Fog.

Who's Cartman, by the way, your pet lizard that you pray to every night?

Here's what you do Elaine, you put the words "Performing Arts Centre" into the search box on Alt-London.

And no, I've never applied for any money from the Creative City, you half-wit. Never will. $500, big deal.

You should consider it though. Use it to buy meds, 'cause you've obviously run out.

So now Tom Gosnell, Dan McDonald, John Matsui, Gord Hume, Cheryl Miller, Bud Polhill, Roger Caranci, Bernie MacDoanld, Paul Van Meerbergen and Steve Orser are your new heroes, eh?

You got taste, elaine. Blind leading the blind.

You typify the suckers in London. They spoonfeed you the slop and you buy it hook, line and sinker, panting for more baloney.

Dumb as a rusty bag of hammers, you are. It wouldn't take much to get you goostepping around in a NAZI uniform, would it?

Tom Gosnell and company own you, lock, stock and barrel. You're just a meat puppet for greedy dummies.

Develop a mind of your own, elaine. Don't believe everything the a-holes tell you.

Elaine said...

I did, no matches.

hahahahaha, you better go write one Barry.

ohhhhhhh, the conspiracy deepens. I now work for Tom Gosnell.

I don't know if I am moving up or down in the world. A couple of months ago I was working for Mossad, and now Tom Gosnell.

Actually I got myself a couple of George Constanza jobs, that keep me quiet busy, pretending I am busy. There is an art to that, and took some adjusting to. It is sweet, not doing too much and getting a paycheque. Sort of like being a politician.

I know though, that the George Constanza jobs are not the backbone of this city. It is the people who go to work every day and produce something tangible.

Anonymous said...

No matches, eh? More evidence that you're as useless as tits on a bull.

I got 15 matches where a Performing Arts Centre is mentioned. Nine stories and six comments.

And by the way, News Hound has never been a supporter of a Performing Arts Centre as envisioned by London's elites.

If urban sprawl is the cat's ass for cities, howcum Toronto is bankrupt and every major city in North America is flirting with bankruptcy?

The reality is unchecked growth is like cancer.

But I'd never expect you to grasp that because you're a meat puppet for the stupidity of the day.

If it's a lousy idea, you're all over it like hair on a retarded gorilla.

Why don't we get you a tattoo for your forehead -- something along the lines of "I bought Gosnell's bullshit and Orser's too!"

Elaine said...

Toronto is bankrupt because they have a socialist mayor, goes by the name of Miller.

You know how the socialist work, throw good money after bad on social programs with no accountability attached to them, and that just don't work.

The working man is waking up to this, and changes are going to be taking place.

I think you better start reading a newspaper or two there Barry. People are sick to death of the spend, spend, spend, steal, steal, steal, of the socialist.

The mood amongst the people is they want to start kicking ass. It is happening here in London, and the socialist cabal are going to be the asses that get kicked.

Anonymous said...

You are a complete idiot incapable of rational debate. Bye.

Elaine said...

....,she is thinking, another one bites the dust, as she is blowing the smoke off the end of her gun.

Anonymous said...

this site is bull, if only you knew what you thought you knew.

Anonymous said...

I know the politicians you speak of but who are these other insiders you're always mentioning, not from here originally, I can barely keep up with the elected officials