Sunday, March 11, 2007

(Y2)Kyoto Rally Report: London, Ontario

I attended this morning's "Y2Kyoto Or Bust" rally/Sunday service here in London's Victoria Park. At least, I caught the tail end. After all, the Earth could wait to be saved until after the last carbon-licious morsels of bacon and coffee had disappeared into my ravenous belly. We show up late so you don't have to.

My gluttony did cause me to miss Irene Mathyssen and Sam Trosow. London West Liberal Sue Barnes put in an appearance, left. (The sign is being held by her interlocutor, not by Ms Barnes).

The crowd was about 100-125 people, of all ages, from children through grandparents.

The first speaker I caught was a young girl in a wheelchair, who told us that although the revolution must begin now, it must begin within ourselves. We were then given the usual list of atonements such as recycling, buying local, and being the change we wish to see.

The final speaker was named Darius. (Audio excerpt 1)

Those who perpetuate the activities that fuel global warming need to be stopped. Those who choose to be ignorant, and simply don't care -- they're the enemy. They're destroying our environment and killing our future generations. We cannot stand idly by while our oceans are being toxified, our trees are being cut down, our air is being poisoned, and our soil is being degraded. There is no action too radical in defence of mother earth. Logging is target. Factory farm is a target. SUVs are a target. Big corporate polluters are a target too. The world is going to hell but we can save it. It's gonna take the greatest revolution in history. The green revolution is here. And it won't be stopped. I hope you're ready.
Let the chanting begin. (Audio excerpt 2)

Put the earth first!
Put the earth first!
Put the earth first!
Put the earth first!
...testament, AKA insurgent,
I'm killing everybody,
Murdering the person who's hurtin' the earth,
When I learn that they're burnin',
...It's their turn now.
But it's self-defence,
Cause it's life or death for the world I protect.
It's one thing to use imagery like that that in a Canadian public park as we walk around on a Sunday morning without fear of being killed by rebels with a cause -- and it's a creepy 'nother to get applauded for pledging allegiance to the idea. And another when members of federal Parliament are in attendance and don't bother to distance themselves from calls like this. Is it just me?

Genteel-looking parents with little children on their shoulders and around their legs cheering notions such as "Fuck the economy!" Folks with peace buttons applauding because fascists and warmongers wear suits, and want nothing to do with chanted declarations of enmity, the enthusiasm of the young, or the desire to all come together to save the world.

People, please. It's nonsense.

45 comments:

Temujin said...

You should not have blacked out part of his face :-) I wish you had asked him what his full name was. He's essentially declared enviro-jihad on our nation!

Dave said...

Is this a spoof. This dude sounds like Fenris Beowulf.

Jake said...

Sounds like the enviro-commies are implying that terrorist crusades against the non-believers in Kyoto are justified. Ahhh...Now I know who set that fire at the Nanticoke Esso refinery a few weeks ago.

Honey Pot said...

Well done Poppy boy!

I can't believe they take this shit so seriously. They are dangerous. Jim Jones or Theodore Kaczynski material as far as I am concerned.

I never thought the eco-terrorist would be aggressive. Looked at them as if they were a bunch of noveau gentle purtians, but hell they had nutso in their eyes.

eng said...

Do you claim that Y2K was all a big hoax?

Alex said...

The great thing about these losers is that as soon as the weed wears off, so does the rhetoric. Soon enough, saving the world is forgotten in favour of finding a bag of doritos and a couch to crash on.

Honey Pot said...

Mike, you did a much better job reporting the news on this silly event than the free press this morning. You should seriously think of doing it for a living. Freeps, just had a big picture of few kids holding a sign with koyoto on it, and a boring blurp about the event. No mention of the eco-terrorist, and their threat to kill business owners, and suv drivers. I am glad I drive a 17 year old rusted-out old van, I think I am safe.I am keeping that van, I might need it to drive to the Thunderdome in Bartertown to watch the fights.

The jury is out on this koyoto deal. The government can't meet the targets without dragging us into a depression in which our country will never recover.

Give it up folks.

eng said...

Do you claim that Y2K was all a big hoax?

Lisa said...

Eng;

Yes, I think Y2K was a big hoax. The evidence? I didn't eat out of a can tonight and I am sitting in front of a functional computer.

Mike said...

Well, I don't think it was a hoax, though a lot of doomsayers had egg on their faces. That's one common thread.

The mechanism for the problems one expected to see with Y2K made sense and were completely understood and deterministic, at least at a low level. The mechanism supposedly creating the need for Kyoto is a flight of fancy and assumptions built on assumptions built on assumptions.

Y2K had a precise moment at which the doomsday was to arrive; but today's Kyoto cultists postulate doom 80 or 100 years from now, long after everyone hearing them will be dead and not around to remind anybody.

I suppose calling the Kyoto racket "Y2Kyoto" is tarring Y2K a bit unjustly. It was different in many ways. The commonality will become more apparent as time passes, the earth doesn't melt, and reminders of past belief in AGW, and political weather-control (of all things), start to look like photographs of one's embarrassing haircuts from the 70s.

Anyways, what do you think about calls to kill disbelievers?

matt said...

I might need it to drive to the Thunderdome in Bartertown to watch the fights.

honey pot, you're a goddamn riot

If non-retards were in charge at the free press the headline would have read "local activist threatens global warming violence" or something. But they didn't have that headline, so you know who is running the free press.

Honey Pot said...

We all know the type that join these cults. They sit around all day forcasting doom and gloom. They can't enjoy anything in life. If I had a suv, or even working brakes on my van, I would be doing doughnuts on the 401...just because I could.

I know money doesn't buy happiness, but it could buy the kind of misery I could live with.

I think deep down inside I am a capitalist pig, a poor one, but one that believes it is the only system that works.

Anonymous said...

I'm glad that you right-wing fascists got the message. I'm watching you too, but don't worry you are not being "targetted" violently, neither are your SUV's or businesses. I see that you assume I mean violence with target, yet target can be interpreted in many ways. Militarized people interpret this word in a military context. However, it is more common to be targetted economically with boycott, or with bad publicity. I target things intellectually because it is more effective than violence. You also misinterpreted my lyrics. I'm not going to kill anyone, i dont need to kill you, you are killing yourselves and the rest of us with the lifestyle you choose.

Peace Always,

your friendly neighbourhood "eco-terrorist"

Honey Pot said...

You are targeting us intellectually? That would be like Corky taking on Bill Gates wouldn't it?

Yes the lifestyle I chose. I chose to drive, I chose to heat and cool my home. I chose to look at the reality of a situation instead of becoming hysterical because I watched some B movie, and went to listen to an arrogant fear monger like the wingnut Prophet Suzuki.

You just cool your jets there... and while your sitting in the dark and being fed bullshit like a good little mushroom, remember we are willing to relieve you of any manmade products you have in your possession, so you won't have to feel so guilty. Like your computer.

eng said...

Anyways, what do you think about calls to kill disbelievers?

The only situation I have heard of in calls to 'kill disbelievers' is from the Islamist terrorists. They do not speak for Muslims, and they do not even speak for political "Islamism".

Are you taking the talking point about climate change being a religion, and combining that with claims by a climate change skeptic that he has received death threats?

In either case, violence is wrong. I distance myself from anyone who advocates physical violence to solve anything.

I also distance myself from anyone who tries to use violence or threats of violence to discredit or bolster one side of an issue, as in "I'm threatened, so I must be right".

To me, it reminds me most of abortion doctors being murdered by violent radicals claiming to be "pro life".

Mike said...

Darius, why didn't you just say that you wanted everyone to, say, sign three petitions a year, or boycott something, instead of leaving open the most obvious interpretations of your words -- especially in the context of invoking the ELF, insurgents, and terrorists? Come on.

Words mean things.

Mike said...

eng:

Are you taking the talking point about climate change being a religion, and combining that with claims by a climate change skeptic that he has received death threats?

Did you read the post? Obviously I'm specifically talking about:

"Those who choose to be ignorant, and simply don't care -- they're the enemy... There is no action too radical in defence of mother earth. Logging is target. Factory farm is a target. SUVs are a target. Big corporate polluters are a target too... Murdering the person who's hur'in the earth... It's their turn now."

And the disturbing lack of rejection from the audience. Group think is powerful but you'd expect someone to have the integrity to say "Hold it a minute, there, young man."

Glad you're on board with the non-violence stuff though.

Honey Pot said...

I know I will sleep better tonight, knowing eng at least aint' going to hunt me down and kill me in my bed for all my mortal sins committed against the environment. Not so sure about Anonyomus there..... he seems a tad fucked up in the head.

You know what I did today Anon? I went to Tim Hortons first thing this morning, had my truck in idle at the take out window, and then let on it was broke down for a half an hour. There was cars lined up to the road and they was all beeping, and screaming out their windows. I just did it because I am a bitch, and I wanted to speed up this global warming stuff. I am sick to death of winter.

How do you like me now?

eng said...

Honey pot, rest easy, harming you is the last thing anyone would want. It would be counterproductive. You have an important role to play. You are morally supporting all the SUV drivers, without actually having one of your own. That's good. Because there simply isn't enough wealth for everyone to have one.

We need people like you. You know your place, and you won't cause trouble for your betters.

When oil costs $500 a barrel, there will be even fewer SUV drivers and they will need you even more to help keep everyone from revolting. Just keep talking up how great the carbon centric life is, and never show envy to your betters. Think of anyone with a motor vehicle as being a kind of celebrity. Don't blame them for having what you cannot have. And encourage as many people as possible to think the same way. We don't want any violence now, do we?

When oil is $800 a barrel, the climate will be much warmer, and though London is on high enough ground that it won't be flooded, the current types of mechanized farming in use will be unaffordable. But the good news is we can grow cotton and other plantation type crops.

We'll need plenty of workers for the plantations, since oil will be too costly to waste on things like farming. Do you have good teeth, and springy hindquarters? If so, don't worry. I'm sure there will be a place for you. I'm sure you will be allowed to eat, and to live.

And by the way, I own a good sized chunk of what is currently swamp land. Paid a song for it, but it will dry out and become a nice plantation in a few decades. Some of those crackpot scientists think the global warming will speed up at some point. I hope so, and I hope you'll still have your health and be able to pull a plow. I'll need you!

Thanks for helping assure my future, whichever way it goes.

Anonymous said...

Reading the collected wisdom of all the above posters - notably Honeypot - it seems as if you have an unhealthy obsession with the fringe left. If you are truly the self-interested "intellectual" materialists you claim to be, shouldn't you be consulting your stock portfolio or reading Yachting Times rather than hanging around freakish events like a bunch of political dirty old men?

Just a thought. You do seem to be enjoying yourselves though...

Honey Pot said...

There will be a revolt alright, it is happening right now. The revolt is against the tree-hugging, leaf-eating new puritans. The problem with people like you, the prophet Suzuki and Goracle, is that you have never seen a hard day's work in your life. You have no understanding that it takes money to run a household, that means a job. Us working grunts know that, and don't like our jobs threatened by the new puritans. The left is being abandoned by the lower socio-economic classes because they know green means no jobs. No jobs means no home, no food, and dependant on a government that will not be able to afford to feed everyone. The ndp is going tits up for that very reason. Their polices appeal to only the lunatic fringe, the new puritans. Though it might be a romantic fantasy for the left to have Canada a third world country, the lower socioeconomic classes have no intention of cooperating.

..and I don't mind being poor, there are worse things. I could be spending my days trying to produce mass hysteria about the end of the world, and thinking up ways to control the every movement and thought of the global climate deniers.

We grunts talk amongst ourselves, and we come up with the consensus that if there is any truth to this global warming, we want to go out with a bang, and not being controlled by some eco-commie government who send out their gestapo to record everytime we turn our lights on, or flush our toilets.

Mike said...

Thanks for the suggestion, anon, but it's too much fun to document rallies and protests. Yachting Times can always wait, and Warren Buffet can always leave a message.

Honey Pot said...

Mike I would go to, but being a grunt I have to go to work. You be careful down there. You are more than welcome to borrow my Tina Turner disguise, but don't strecth the hell out of my fishnet stockings.

Honey Pot said...

..hey better yet, how about my burka disguise? Hell you will fit right in with the terrorist supporters in attendance. I have it fitted with a tiny weenie camera, a fridge, and a microwave in case you get hungry. You would be amazed what you can fit under a burka.

Honey Pot said...

I just have to tell you Annoy. I was thinking about you this morning and I jacked my heat up to 90 and I took all my expensive bulbs out, and put all my cheap bulbs in. I then turned on every light in the house. I cooked a great big mother of a turkey in the gas oven, and put the plastic margine container and coolwhip bowl in the garbage bag instead of the blue box. You are pissing me off, and if you keep it up I am going to start throwing my newspapers and magazines in the garbage can too. You freakin' glowtards are getting under my skin.

eng said...

honey pot, you forgot to mention you're also going to stamp your feet and leave your diaper off.

So does your landlord pay for all the extra energy you decided to use today? Or do you just open the street grate a little wider?

I'm sure someone else is paying for it though. That's the way it is with you isn't it? Always someone else's fault and stick them with your bills.

Honey Pot said...

Bite your tongue! I am not, nor have I ever been a member of the ndp party.

I pay my own way. I work hard for my money, dadadada, I work hard for my money dadadada I work hard for my money, and I will spend it as I chose. I chose to be a carbon emitting mean machine, so you can bite me.

Just for that, you eco-terrorist, I am going to go out and buying a stack of paper plates, plastic forks, and have my furnace switched over to oil.

How do you like me now?

eng said...

I don't know how much I like you, honey pot. You haven't given any indication that you will be up to picking cotton on my plantation. If you're sickly, you won't be much use to me, so I would not like you as much in one future.

It seems you want to work there on my plantation, since you are doing everything you can to bring about that future, but there might be no place for you, if you can't pull your weight.

If you are just going to be a useless eater, the government you elected that allowed things to get to that state might be unwilling to help you. They will be too busy looking after themselves, and won't really care anyway, since they will have put an end to this stupid one person one vote system, and replaced it with one acre one vote. You have no acres, you get no vote. I will still have plenty of acres, but I will find it difficult to extend rights to the peasants in a world of scarcity.

I'd rather live in a future where we are all still free, where we have put in the effort to stop the catastrophic climate change that is likely to happen if we do nothing, and where my swamp land remains a nature area.

But you would rather have that 1% of GST (that's the cost of Kyoto you know), so you can save a few pennies on your coffee, and consume as much as you can afford in the most inefficient ways. As the cost of oil spirals, your wastefulness will end because you won't be able to afford it, but the damage will be done.

I hope we can have the future I would prefer. I hope you will be free, maybe driving a low emission vehicle, using cleanly generated power. But I don't have a lot of faith in people changing, especially with folks like yourself running like lemmings to the other future. So I am prepared. I will survive either way, and if it requires putting you under the yoke (should you be healthy enough), so be it.

gm said...

Alvin Tofler, Paul Erhlich, Thomas Malthus. Old school Marxists rejected Malthus but the Greens embrace him.

Julian Simon was right and Erhlich was wrong. When you found out about this let me know.

Mike said...

Eng, no matter how dire the predictions, however unanimous the science du jour, however widespread the propaganda, however strong the human will to fix what ain't broke, apocalyptic cults have always been wrong in the past. This is embodied in the alchemical mystery of Chicken Little and Foxy Loxy.

Eat, drink, emit carbon like a Gore, and be merry; for many long years from now you will die, and the earth will be pretty much exactly like it is now.

eng said...

Mike, you sound like the guy falling off the building. As he passes the 10th floor he says:

"So far so good!"

Was the Montreal Protocol on CFCs just a big scam too? Seems to me the ozone layer is actually recovering. I wonder why?

Are catalytic converters in cars a big ripoff? The lead in gasoline was not a problem?

Which apocalyptic cults are you talking about? Oh, yes I forgot, the climate change as religion talking point.

It is not a religion. It is just science.

You are correct that the apocalyptic cults have always been wrong. But I consider the "we'll freeze in the dark living in shacks" and the "our economy will be destroyed" tales to be the words of apocalyptic cults. And you're right, they were always wrong in the past, and they are now.

Honey Pot said...

Dont' be worrying about me in the future eng. I will be running the Thunderdome in Bartertown. Stop by and try your luck in the new puritans gone wild ring.You know the law: Two men enter, one man leaves.
I am sure another mutant will gladly take you on, and over for your plantation.

Mike said...

It is not a religion. It is just science.

-- L. Ron Hubbard

eng said...

L. Ron Hubbard is not a scientist.
But nice try at changing the channel.

Honey pot just threatened my life. So much for your feigned fear of the punks at the demonstration.

But he/she is nowhere near bad enough to get even close to reaching Thunderdome, let alone running it. I am quite sure there will be a functioning government, probably the natural end state of the current right wing, a police state. I'm ready.

Honey Pot said...

I am not afraid for my life, I am not going to the rally, but I am concerned about Mike's safety. That is why I think a police officer or two present would be appreciated. I am sure everyone will be well behaved, now that they realize their craziness is being recorded.

I do realize someone in your world would consider it a threat to their life if I filled my gas guzzler to the brim and drove around town and stopped at every Tim Horton's drive-thru I could hit.... but in the real world, that is still legal,and you can't physically harm someone for it. Until the new puritans set up their own glowtard government and police force, I am going to do it.

I know you are having a real hard time dealing with reality. You have yourself worked up to a state of complete and total fucktardiness because of this global warming fantasy. The doctors haven't put a name to this mental disorder you are suffering from yet. I myself just call it glowtard paranoia.

Eng, I don't want to see you and your weird friends get in trouble, so please try very hard to contain your nutso impluses at the terrorist supporters/glowtard rally tomorrow afternoon.

eng said...

No, you did threaten me: "Two men enter, one man leaves."

But I don't feel threatened, nor do I even care about your wastefulness, because that will end soon enough. Unless of course you are very wealthy and can afford it.


Of course you are not afraid for your life, it's just phony posturing. You are engaged in a campaign of continuous trash talking, hoping someone, please someone, will give you a verbal threat, then you can milk that with "see, I'm right! They want to harm me for being right!"

The only problem is you seem to have run out of insults. You have overused "glowtard", "terrorist supporter", "nutso", "fucktardiness", "new puritans", "craziness", "ecoterrorist", "weird" and you seem to have nothing else.

And now you're recycling your insults! I thought you were deliberately not recycling garbage in order to make your point that it is legal to be a fool, and to try and get someone to participate in your drama.

It really is getting smelly here, with the amount of bait you keep putting out. And perhaps I am taking the bait by bothering to comment here. But you must find it frustrating that all your name calling has not garnered one threat, one punch, nothing. You can insult me as much as you wish, you will not get any reactions that help your position by default.

You will not silence me. There is a problem, it needs to be addressed, it will not wreck our economy to fix it, and nothing you can say will change that reality.


I know you are getting desperate to change the channel on this, you really wish the people who give a damn would get all "worked up to a state of complete and total fucktardiness". But it looks like you are the one exhibiting those symptoms the most. The people who give a damn about our world just want to see some effort made to stop putting so much CO2 into the air, because it is likely to cause the climate to change.

Your baiting, insulting, and pretense of fear is not going to change the situation from a simple problem solving exercise, into what you want, which is a screaming match that results in nothing getting done.

I am sure your agents provocateurs will be at the rallies, being conspicuously wasteful, hoping someone will take a swing at them. And your targets will be egged on by your moles who have infiltrated the protesters, hoping to set them up.

Yes, I'm sure your people will do their best to create an incident, invent a crisis, all so they can smugly claim that their view is correct.


It still doesn't refute the science. Nor does a documentary with five, (count'em five!) scientists.

Lisa said...

"Yes, I'm sure your people will do their best to create an incident, invent a crisis, all so they can smugly claim that their view is correct."

That's a pretty accurate description of Al Gore and David Suzuki's marketing strategy.

eng said...

Lisa: Is taking other peoples' words out of context part of their strategy as well? Because it seems to be yours, and it ain't workin'.

Lisa said...

Eng;

Seems to me only adherents to approved religions need attend the "public" protest. Is that part of their strategy as well, because I'm not convinced it's working.

MapMaster said...

Five scientists is about two-and-a-half times as many actual scientists as I've ever seen gathered in one place to support the contention that anthropogenic CO2 emissions will cause catastrophic climate change, for that matter. "It's all about the science" is the mantra precisely because it's nothing to do with the science. The overwhelming majority of people, and I include myself and presumably yours as well, will rarely get as far as an actual paper and rely instead upon second- or third-hand abstractions of someone else's syntheses of actual science — abstractions of abstractions upon abstractions, etc. At that point, our positions reflect as much as anything personal preferences. For myself, CO2 driving massive climate shifts doesn't pass the smell test of plausibility, but I understand that others might see it differently. The 99.99% of pundits asserting a position on the science itself should admit that they don't actually know a damned thing, and the 0.01% of climate scientists should be careful about the relevance, precision and accuracy of their own bits of knowledge too.

The germane topic, in the absence of certainty about the science, is the response to the issue, of which more certainty can be supposed. With or without dramatic climate shifts in response or not to CO2, political solutions themselves will simply serve political interests. Unproductive jobs will be created to increase dependence on governments, regulations will be created to satisfy vocal constituencies, and taxes will be implemented to enhance revenues — but CO2 emissions will certainly not decrease. Politicians in the last twenty years or so have become particularly adept at continuing regulatory and tax intrusions just within the limits of allowing the economic expansion that pays for them, and there's no reason not to expect that to continue. But should dramatic climate shifts occur, regulations and taxes will certainly hamper the ability of people to adapt to them effectively and efficiently.

If there were any ethical imperatives involved in climate change, why should anyone want political actors to subsume those ethics under political interests? There lies the antithesis of ethics.

Honey Pot said...

Those who perpetuate the activities that fuel global warming need to be stopped. Those who choose to be ignorant, and simply don't care -- they're the enemy. They're destroying our environment and killing our future generations. We cannot stand idly by while our oceans are being toxified, our trees are being cut down, our air is being poisoned, and our soil is being degraded. There is no action too radical in defence of mother earth. Logging is target. Factory farm is a target. SUVs are a target. Big corporate polluters are a target too. The world is going to hell but we can save it. It's gonna take the greatest revolution in history. The green revolution is here. And it won't be stopped. I hope you're ready.-glowtard mantra


Eng perhaps you could explain this little ditty to us. I take that as a threat. No action to radical to stop it, is a threat, no matter how you slice it. What radical steps were you planning to act out to stop it?

Dress warm.

Going to be a cold day for the terrorist supporters and glowtards to be out protesting methinks.

eng said...

Well it was nice to see "mapmaster" making a comment that, compared to the tripe from the likes of "honey pot", is truly a breath of fresh air. Only minor mischaracterisations of my statements.

But then we're back to honey pot, using the same old tired rhetorical devices. Now I'm supposed to defend a statement that I have earlier said I distance myself from. Not content with that, honey pot proceeds to ask how I was planning to act on said statements.

And honey pot, what's the matter? Only "glowtard" and "terrorist supporters" today? No other insults? Where's your usual rant about driving all over the place out of spite? Or did the price of gas go up today? And I missed being asked how do I like you now. What's the matter? I wish I knew what "glowtard" means, though. There's an opening for you, you can drop a nice big steaming dump here and explain that is the definition.

So honey, it looks like you still cannot silence me, and your attempts to paint me as some radical terrorist are becoming more and more absurd. Looks like you need a resupply of insults and fake outrage.

Perhaps you will let mapmaster change the topic back to the science, even though taunting you is more fun.

Honey Pot said...

A glowtard is a global warming retard. Play on words, so to speak. You don't taunt me. I find you glowtards, very entertaining and foolish, in your quest to control other people's lives.

I suppose I should be careful, as you glowtards have a tendency to be on the nutso radical side of things.

I don't want to silence you. I want you to be at the forefront of this glowtard movement. It is like having Taliban Jack as the ndp leader. You know there is not a chance in hell of the ndp every coming to power in this country, as long as they have a weak-troll as their leader. For that we can all be thankful.

eng said...

Wow, honey pot, you took the words right out of my mouth!


A neocon is a neo-nazi con artist. Play on words, so to speak. You don't taunt me. I find you neocons, very entertaining and foolish, in your quest to control other people's lives.

I suppose I should be careful, as you neocons have a tendency to be on the nutso radical side of things.

I don't want to silence you. I want you to be at the forefront of this neocon movement. It is like having Stephen Hitler as the CPC leader. You know there is not a chance in hell of the CPC ever staying to power in this country, as long as they have a weak-troll as their leader. For that we can all be thankful.

Jake said...

eng,

Ahh yes, Stephen Hitler is a neo-con alright. Him and his Harris-era finance minister today announced one of the biggest social spending budgets in Canadian history. No slash and burn Harris neo-con cuts to welfare or massive tax reductions for oil companies today. My goodness, this neo-con is increasing the budget for the Status of Women and the environment!